Season 1 Episode 1 - Interview with Duane Hamacher author of The First Astronomers

In the inaugural episode of the Book Science podcast, host Tripp Collins interviews Duane Hamacher, an Associate Professor of Cultural Astronomy in the ASTRO-3D Centre of Excellence and the School of Physics at the University of Melbourne, about his book, The First Astronomers: How Indigenous Elders Read the Stars, co-authored with Indigenous elders. Over 15 years, Duane’s journey revealed the significant scientific insights embedded in Aboriginal astronomy, challenging initial dismissiveness towards these knowledge systems. He emphasizes the collaborative nature of the book, which intertwines technical astronomy with accessibility, themes of cultural science, and the integral relationship between Indigenous knowledge and the environment. The discussion explores Indigenous scientific observations—like the predictive prowess of Torres Strait Islanders, their sophisticated narratives around astronomical phenomena, and the cultural significance of these traditions. Duane also highlights upcoming projects that aim to further bridge Indigenous knowledge with contemporary scientific understanding, advocating for a mutual respect and humility in learning from these rich cultural insights. 
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Show Notes

Full Transcript Here

Introduction to Duane Hamacher and Indigenous Astronomy (00:00 - 05:00)

• ​Duane Hamacher is introduced as Associate Professor of Cultural Astronomy at University of Melbourne
• Discussion focuses on Duane's book 'The First Astronomers: How Indigenous Elders Read the Stars'
• Book was co-written with Indigenous elders and knowledge holders including Ghillar Michael Anderson, John Barsa, David Bosun, Ron Day, Segar Passi, and Alo Tapim.

Genesis of the Book and Indigenous Knowledge (05:00 - 16:00)

• Duane shares how the book was 15 years in the making, starting when he came to Australia 21 years ago
• Initially faced dismissive responses when asking about Aboriginal astronomy
• Discovered significant science embedded in Aboriginal astronomical knowledge
• Worked with Torres Strait Islander elders over a decade to document their astronomical traditions
• Book required collaboration with 6 Indigenous elders as co-authors (publisher limited number of authors)
• Purpose of the book: showcase Indigenous science knowledge and preserve cultural continuity

Book Structure and Writing Process (16:00 - 25:00)

• Book not written in linear fashion - variable stars chapter written first, introduction written last
• Each chapter themed around different astronomical phenomena (most with 'star' in the title)
• Focus on science behind star knowledge rather than just naming constellations
• Book balances technical astronomy concepts with accessibility for general readers
• Duane structured narrative around three major themes: 'as above, so below,' cultural science, and reading environment for survival
• Challenge of writing trade (popular) book versus academic papers required different approach

Knowledge Systems and Scientific Observation (25:00 - 35:00)

• Indigenous knowledge systems evolve over time to adapt to changing environments
• Knowledge shared has different levels - public knowledge vs. restricted deeper knowledge
• Indigenous cultures observed variable stars (like Betelgeuse) thousands of years before Western detection
• Indigenous knowledge involves carefully reading environment including stars, animals, and weather
• Discussion of Indigenous protocols around knowledge sharing and transmitting cultural knowledge

Indigenous Scientific Observations (35:00 - 50:00)

• Example of Torres Strait Islanders predicting eclipses and planning ceremonies around them
• Aboriginal stories describe variable brightness of stars like Betelgeuse, showing sophisticated astronomical observation
• Discussion of the Seven Sisters songline (based on Pleiades star cluster) that crosses Australia
• Indigenous astronomy integrates with navigation, weather prediction, and cultural laws
• Indigenous knowledge not given credit for scientific observations that preceded Western discoveries

️ Meteorite Impacts and Cultural Stories (50:00 - 01:00:00)

• Duane shares dangerous desert experience using astronomical knowledge to navigate when lost
• Discussion of meteorite crater (Tnorala/Gosses Bluff Crater) in central Australia
• Western Arrernte people's creation story involves star baby falling from Milky Way creating crater
• Scientific dating shows crater is 142 million years old, matches Indigenous creation narrative
• Appearance of Corona Australis constellation interpreted as wooden basket falling from sky
• Book cover features artwork by Elder Segar Passi showing sunset, symbolizing when astronomy begins

Final Thoughts and Future Projects (01:00:00 - 01:09:54)

• Duane recommends other books on Indigenous knowledge, including 'Astronomy Sky Country'
• Upcoming book project: 'Welcome to Sky Country' as companion to Marcia Langton's work
• Developing university courses on cultural astronomy and Indigenous knowledge
• IAU-funded symposium 'Indigenous Astronomy in the Space Age' planned for July next year
• Duane emphasizes importance of learning from Indigenous knowledges with humility
• Resources available at aboriginalastronomy.com.au and thefirstastronomers.com

Books Mentioned

Astronomy: Sky Country by Karlie Noon and Krystal De Napoli (Margo Neale [Editor])
The Memory Code by Lynne Kelly
Memory Craft by Lynne Kelly 
The Knowledge Gene by Lynne Kelly
Arctic Sky by John MacDonald
Hawaiki Rising by Sam Low
​The Spirit in the Sky by Mark Hollabaugh
ANNETTE S. LEE | Artist-Astronomer | Indigenous | DSc | PhD | MFA | MFA